Podcast with Tamir Shklaz Part 2
In this thought-provoking podcast episode with Tamir Shklaz,the co-founder of Strive, we explore the shifting role of teachers in the age
of AI and the urgent need for a revolution in education. Tamir challenges the
traditional approach of education, emphasizing that teachers should guide the
process of learning, motivate, and foster adaptability in students rather than
just imparting knowledge. As the job landscape rapidly evolves, the podcast
delves into the critical importance of equipping children with the skills to
learn and adapt to the unknown challenges of the future. Discover how Strive
seeks to provide a compelling alternative, focusing on holistic development,
coding education, and empowering kids with the skill of learning how to learn.
Join us on this captivating journey of education transformation and its impact
on our children's future.
In Part 2 of the podcast with Tamir Shklaz, the discussionrevolved around the evolving role of teachers in the age of AI and the need for
a paradigm shift in education. Tamir emphasized that teachers should guide the
social process of learning, motivate, and encourage students, rather than
merely providing information. He highlighted the importance of adaptability and
learning how to learn, given the rapidly changing job landscape. While the
current education system is still rooted in a traditional approach, Tamir's
company, Strive, aims to offer a complementary alternative that focuses on
holistic development and teaching coding, technical skills, and adaptability to
help kids thrive in the 21st century.
[00:00:00] Tamir Shklaz: Really what the role of theteacher is. And this is becoming especially evident with AI and chat GPT is not
to have all the knowledge, the role of the teachers to guide the social process
of learning. It's to motivate the students. It's to encourage the students.
It's to enable the student to answer problems on their own and find information
on their own, not to give the student information.
[00:00:23] Tamir Shklaz: And so a huge part of what wethen look at when we're looking at teachers is how well can they emotionally
engage with the student? Can they empathize with them? Can they understand
them? Can they speak to their level? Are they patient? That's like the one of
the most important
[00:00:38] Andrew Liew: talking along that line, yes, Itotally align with you is that's probably the new way however, if you think
about it in the good old, very good old days my parents or even your parents
and grandparents, school was born it's almost as a social construct to enable,
let's say, I don't remember the Henry Ford thing where they make the cars and
they have to go in the line of assembly.
[00:00:59] Andrew Liew: So at that [00:01:00] time, those schools, even Harvard, likewhere there's monastery was taught to teach people how to do things step by
step. So it's like you said, it's a monologue. It's like a water pollen to a
glass and it's very one way. And their job is to like, do you know how to put a
not 10 books in her car and get it going?
[00:01:16] Andrew Liew: And the, modern new world whereinformation are so plentiful. And, also the good old days is economy of skill,
right? I have one teacher, I have 40 students, I just teach. Whether or not the
kids absorb as long as they pass on grade one to the next grade, the whole
system seems to work. But today apparently, the kind of jobs that we are
seeing, the kind of skills and the business requirements for kids with skills
is in wide vast, vastity.
[00:01:44] Andrew Liew: Just a classical one, let's say Iwas in a bank or even an airline company, there are like 20, 30 software system
and every system, some system will be using Python, some system using
different functions. And so this [00:02:00]requires different skill sets and these things are not found in schools, right?
[00:02:04] Andrew Liew: And so coming back to this whatis your view on that digital transformation for kids to learn? Do you think
it's a new dawn of age where that's why you guys came out to do this?
[00:02:15] Tamir Shklaz: Yeah, I think you hit the nailon the head and that the schooling system was originally designed for the
industrial revolution in order to create A large amount of factory workers
skilled factory workers that were able to assemble cars or participate in the
[00:02:31] Tamir Shklaz: And that model has evolvedultimately to the 21st century. But we need to rethink it. From first
principles today, not based off of what it was originally designed for 100
years ago. And the biggest aspect is that when it was designed, the jobs that
kids were doing were well defined. So when a kid started grade 1, we knew
[00:02:56] Tamir Shklaz: Hey, they're likely to be amechanic or an accountant or a lawyer or a [00:03:00]doctor. That knowledge is well established and isn't going to change. So when
they finish grades, 12 after the 18 years of school what they started with,
they would have a solid foundation to then pursue these well known subjects.
[00:03:15] Tamir Shklaz: What's happening today is. Everyfive years, jobs are becoming obsolete, changing, adapting and that rate is
only increasing because of the exponential nature of technological change. So
it means that when a kid starts school in grade one, we have absolutely no idea
what jobs they're going to be doing by the time they graduate.
[00:03:34] Tamir Shklaz: Those jobs don't even exist yet.So trying to teach kids a syllabus that is highly structured, highly
prescriptive. Is a waste of time, and that's where it comes back to what I was
speaking about in the LinkedIn post. The most important skill that we can then
give kids is how to adapt is how to learn because they need to be in a position
that they can adapt to.
[00:03:58] Tamir Shklaz: Their job being replaced [00:04:00] when they come out of school, they need tobe in a position that they can train themselves on a new job that just came
out. That is the reality that we're going to be moving towards. And so that's
what kids need to be able to do. And therefore, what we need to be able to
equip them in schooling.
[00:04:14] Andrew Liew: Like you really rightly put it soin the new day and age all this knowledge that they put in school Will be
obsolete by the time they came out to do a company or get a job which things
are moving so fast however, like as we've seen I mean the current government in
all nations They're still having this let's have a primary school a secondary
school a grammar school and all sorts of schools And it is still in a very
structured like a one teacher to 40 students, right?
[00:04:44] Andrew Liew: And when we the technologist wastrying to tell these educator of government policy. Can you change? Why do you
think they are not changing as dramatic as we want to?
[00:04:56] Tamir Shklaz: It's a brilliant question. Andhonestly, the answer to this [00:05:00]question, if you can figure it out, I think you, you'll become a billionaire or
trillionaire because that is the, big question that we need to be able to
answer of how do we actually transition because it isn't as simple, right?
[00:05:10] Tamir Shklaz: It's not as simple as justsaying we need to change the syllabus. When you change all this stuff, there is
so many. Existing institutions that were based on our entire university system,
the way we assess for jobs. Everything around a society is built around this,
and we need a very nuanced approach on how to change it.
[00:05:28] Tamir Shklaz: Okay, how why, haven'tgovernments adapted yet? One reason is that. It's the system that they grew up
in, right? So the education ministers and the people in charge are basing their
thinking off of incremental improvements to the system that they were raised
in. But what is really needed is a complete redesign from first principles, not
incremental changes to an outdated system.
[00:05:55] Tamir Shklaz: And so It's just, I think, amatter of timing before existing [00:06:00]ministers start to see this or people from younger generations become these
ministers who are thinking this way.
[00:06:07] Andrew Liew: I totally align with you and likeyou put it very well in that they came from the system. So it's a very
classical situation when you talk to politicians on about education systems or
even about labor markets.
[00:06:19] Andrew Liew: And so the, some of the commonthing that they always like to say is, why fix a system that is not broken?
Because they came from the system that tried to serve them well, and so they
can't see That, hey, things are very different now, because now when you're a
minister, you're making say, the top quantile of the society in any country.
[00:06:39] Andrew Liew: They won't see the dynamicstruggles and undercurrent that the kids, by the time they came out oh, why am
I still not getting a job? Oh, why do I... have to relearn in a new job and the
learning curve is so steep that we are seeing a rise of mental health issues
among the young people and the most common thing that they are saying is I'm
burnt out, I'm [00:07:00] learning a lot andI'm having a headache because the dramatic mindset of learning in the So called
all incremental system and the new system that is required.
[00:07:09] Andrew Liew: That's a huge paradigm shift Andthe reason why i'm asking this is because I mean in classically in singapore We
that's a phenomenon, right? We call it the tuition market in south. We also
have called the tuition market and The way the, parents would get the kids to
do is to, oh you have to get, let's say, for math, like 99 out of a hundred, so
that you can go into, let's say, in Singapore, like National University of
Singapore, or in Korea is Korea University, which is the top echelon.
[00:07:38] Andrew Liew: And so by doing that, they areable to get a job whether or not they can learn the skills is a problem. And so
when you think about that, because if we are not able to, how do we actually
Educate or shout out to parents listening to this podcast that hey, we can't be
Following the Jones yeah, let's go into the top university [00:08:00] and then my kid, my job is, done as aparent and they get into, let's say Google or Microsoft bank, but there's this
phenomenon of this mental illnesses coming up because of that shift, huge gap
in a paradigm shift.
[00:08:13] Andrew Liew: How can we, or how do you thinkthat what is your view on that?
[00:08:17] Tamir Shklaz: It's a problem where I just haveso much empathy. Parents that are going through this. It's such a hard problem
because you have such a momentum behind this test prep system. You have such a
competitive environment that parents are so afraid of their kids falling behind
[00:08:37] Tamir Shklaz: And even if they're aware, ifyou're aware, as a parent of all of these problems we've spoken about
previously, two things are still true. One, it doesn't exist a good enough
alternative outside of the existing school system that addresses all of these
problems. There isn't a comprehensive schooling system yet.
[00:08:54] Tamir Shklaz: And one that addresses all ofthe needs of a kid. That is alternative[00:09:00]to the existing system, you'll have little homeschooling things here or there,
but they'll have their issues like we're in the process of discovering what is
the right alternative existing school systems have had 100 years to get pretty
good at doing what they're doing.
[00:09:15] Tamir Shklaz: And the other one is that Thesociety is not adapted to these new schooling systems. The society is adapted
towards, okay, the top marks in math are going to get into the top
universities. The top, the students in the top universities are going to get
the top jobs at Google. So if you're sitting at a pair, like as a parent, it
still makes the most sense to be like, no, I need my, even if.
[00:09:36] Tamir Shklaz: I know that them doing this testis going to have absolutely zero relevance on the rest of their life. It's
still the best decision I can make for my kid to secure their future because
there aren't compelling enough alternatives yet.
[00:09:49] Andrew Liew: Right. There isn't a lot ofcompelling. Is that the reason that prompted you and your co founder to look at
this to say, Hey, we are going to create a very compelling [00:10:00] paradigm shift that.
[00:10:01] Andrew Liew: The parents, let's say they knowthey are going to follow the Jones, right? Everybody's just gonna send my kids.
I have so many coworkers sending three or four subjects tutor to one kid and
Hey, you're going to look at strive map or just a different way of slowly
changing that paradigm. What's your view?
[00:10:19] Tamir Shklaz: For sure. That was definitelythe intention, right? To start giving parents and kids an alternative to. To what exists, or at least less of an alternative. We look at Strata as more of a complementary to the system. I think we need to, the way we'll transition from
one system to another is through incremental change, not through a, let's throw
the baby out with the bath water.
[00:10:40] Tamir Shklaz: So this is an after schoolprogram, which is then focusing on more holistic development of their kid as opposed to academic. Performance, but it really is still one small, piece in the grand scheme of things that need to change when it comes to education. That
from emotional intelligence, leadership assessment.
[00:10:59] Tamir Shklaz: The list is massive, but there's certainly a start with. Coding education, high quality technical education, and the most important thing, which I think is
just adaptability and teaching kids the skill of learning how to learn. And
that's, those I'd say are the two things that we really focus on at Strive..